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  • Dorian Ertymexx

    tycker du att homosexuella ska få gifta sig i kyrkan?

    Jan 39 skrev 2007-09-18 20:45:16 följande:


    Det är (för mig) klart att Bibeln är skriven av människor.Många människor under årens gång.Men kyrkan vilar på Bibelns ord och KAN därför inte bortse från vad Bibeln innehåller av kraftigt fördömande av t ex homosexuella handlingar.
    Du förutsätter att bibeln är logisk, enkel och aldrig motsäger sig själv, och därmed inte är tolkningsbar. Och att alla är bokstavstrogna. Så är inte fallet.
  • Dorian Ertymexx

    Free Spirit skrev 2007-09-18 21:46:56 följande:


    Ja handliger!! I Gt straffet Gud synden, men i NT gjelder nåden på grunn av Jesu verk på Golgata og dermed Guds tilgivelse. Hvilken forskjell!!
    Så återigen HAR gud ändrat sig. Så hur är det med GT, gäller den eller inte?
  • Dorian Ertymexx

    Free Spirit skrev 2007-09-18 21:48:44 följande:


    Nu forstår eg ik hva du mener!!
    Det ante mig...

    Om det är fel med alkohol, måste ju Jesu handling att förvandla vatten till vin ha varit syndigt värre.

    Och att dessutom mena att ALLA kristna ska synda (dricka vin som vore det hans blod). Det låter ju... märkligt.
  • Dorian Ertymexx

    Free Spirit skrev 2007-09-18 22:05:59 följande:


    Har ik sakt eg eiger sanningen, men sier bare hva Ordet sier klart og tydligt!!
    Det har du visst. Många gånger i flera olika trådar, dessutom. Du har sagt att det bara finns en sanning. Eller menade du att det bara finns en sanning, och du tror fel???
  • Dorian Ertymexx

    Free Spirit skrev 2007-09-18 22:05:59 följande:


    Har ik sakt eg eiger sanningen, men sier bare hva Ordet sier klart og tydligt!!
    Det har du visst. Många gånger i flera olika trådar, dessutom. Du har sagt att det bara finns en sanning. Eller menade du att det bara finns en sanning, och du tror fel???
  • Dorian Ertymexx

    Free Spirit skrev 2007-09-18 22:15:31 följande:


    Så alle som ik godtar homosekxualitet samenlignes med "de som flyger in i skyskrapor"Vet ik om eg skal le eller gråte..du er ik sann!! Å stå opp for det som eg ser på som galt er  det samme som å myrde over 4000 mennesker på en horribel og grusom måte..jaja!! du får lov å ha ditt syn..stakkars deg!!Eg har sagt at eg ik trenger lese Bibelen for å å vite at homofili er galt, men du vil ik høre på det øre. Faktisk så kan selv et barn legge sammen to pluss to, og se hva som er rett i den saken. Men det som er viktigt for dere i den saken er hva dei føler og ik føler..Det blir feil, all kjærlighet er ik rett!! Det er ik føleser , men hva vi er skapt til å være.Mann og kvinne!!
    Fel. Man och kvinna och kvinna. Och vi ska vara nakna också.

    Och jag undrar fortfarande vart det menas att hur gud skapar saker förbjuder oss från alternativ. Jag menar, om att gud skapade man och kvinna på något subtilt sätt är ett förbud från homosexualitet, är inte det faktum att gud inte skapade en jumbojet bredvid Adam och Eva ett förbud mot att vi ska flyga flygplan då?
  • Dorian Ertymexx

    Free Spirit skrev 2007-09-18 22:55:12 följande:


    Eg vet ik hva som gjør deg til en kristen i dine øyne, men det er Biblen som avgjør hvem som er kristen. Om vi da går til Guds ord og leser i Rom 10:9-10For dersom du bekjenner Herren Jesus med din munn og tro i ditt hjerte at Gud har oppreist Ham fra det døde, ska dul bli frelst. For med hjerte tror en til rettferdighet og med munnen bekjenner en til frelse.Synd er alt som går imot Gud Ord! For å ta noen ex som eg kommer på just nu: Men det som en ik gjør i tro er synd!! Synd er å ik tro på Jesus!! (husker ik i farten hvor det står, men kan finne dem om du selv vill lese)Vem mer än du själv och Gud kan säga att du är frälst?Hm.. Det forstod eg ik helt meningen med.Hur kan någon veta sanningen?Guds Ord er sannheten (vel, ik alle som er ening med det då) Dessuten om en er frelst og født på ny så har en DHÅ og om en lar Han få lede en og åpenbare Ordet så vil Han vise oss det. (regner med å få reaksjoner på dette, spes fra ufrelste)Vem har rätt att säga till en annan att denne äger sanningen? Den som har sannheten Är det kristet att fördöma?Nei!! Det er Guds Ord som fordømmer!! Som tex om eg ser deg stjele på en butikk, og eg går bort til deg og sier: Du!! Det er galt å stjele desse tingen!! Er det å fordømme deg då?
    Olika versioner på vad man måste göra för att bli frälst:

    Say the right things.
    For by thy words thou shalt be justified. -- Matthew 12:37

    Do the right things.
    And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life. -- John 5:29
    For you render to each one according to his works. -- Psalm 62:12

    I the Lord ... give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings. -- Jeremiah 17:10

    When the wicked man turneth away from his wickedness ... and doeth that which is lawful and right, he shall save his soul. -- Ezekiel 18:27

    For the Son of Man will come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and then He will reward each according to his works. Matthew 16.27

    Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in: Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me. -- Matthew 25:34-36

    Who will render to each one according to his deeds. ... For not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified. -- Romans 2:6, 13

    For we must all appear before the jugment seat of Christ, that each one may receive the things done in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad. -- 2 Corinthians 5:10

    Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers of righteousness, whose end will be according to their works. -- 2 Corinthians 11:15

    The Father, who without partiality judges according to each one's work. -- 1 Peter 1:17

    I will give unto every one of you according to your works. -- Revelation 2:23

    And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. -- Revelation 20:12-13

    Believe the right things.
    A man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law. -- Romans 3:28
    Therefore, being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ. -- Romans 5:1

    A man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ. -- Galatians 2:16

    For by grace are ye saved through faith. -- Ephesians 2:8

    Do and believe the right things.
    Faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. James 2:17

    Believe in Jesus.
    Whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. -- John 3:16
    He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life -- John 3:36

    Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved. -- Acts 16:31

    Be born again.
    Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. -- John 3:3

    Hear the words of Jesus and believe in whoever sent him.
    He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life. -- John 5:24

    Be born of water and the spirit.
    Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. -- John 3:5

    Be washed by the Holy Ghost.
    Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost. -- Titus 3:5

    Be converted and become like a little child.
    Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven. -- Matthew 18:3

    Believe and be baptized.
    He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved. -- Mark 16:16

    Call upon the name of the Lord.
    Whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved. -- Acts 2:21

    Confess with your mouth "Jesus is Lord" and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead.
    If thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. -- Romans 10:9

    Follow the commandments (at least some of them).
    If you want to enter into life, keep the commandments. He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. -- Matthew 19:17-19
    Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life. -- Revelation 22:14

    Keep the commandments (at least some of them), give all your money to the poor, and follow Jesus.
    And a certain ruler asked him, saying, Good Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? ... Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother. And he said, All these have I kept from my youth up.
    ...thou one thing: sell all that thou hast, and distribute unto the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, follow me.-- Luke 18:18-22

    Keep the commandments and the faith of Jesus.
    Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus. -- Revelation 14:12

    Endure to the end.
    He that endureth to the end shall be saved. -- Matthew 10:22, 24:13, Mark 13:13

    Wait until you die and then get baptized.
    Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead? -- 1 Corinthians 15:29

    Don't judge other people.
    Judge not, and ye shall not be judged. -- Matthew 7:1, Lk.6:37

    Have lots of babies.
    And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression. Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing. -- 1 Timothy 2:14-15

    Don't defile yourself with women. (Be a virgin male.)
    ...the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth. These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. -- Revelation 14:3-4

    Be given by the Father and come to the Son.
    All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out. -- John 6:37

    Be chosen (predestinated) by God.
    For many are called, but few are chosen. -- Matthew 22:14
    For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate ... Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.-- Romans 8:29-30

    For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth. -- Romans 9:11

    He hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love. Having predestinated us ... according to the good pleasure of his will. -- Ephesians 1:4-5

    Be poor, not rich.
    Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven. And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God. -- Matthew 19:23-24
    But woe unto you that are rich! for ye have received your consolation. -- Luke 6:24

    Ye rich men, weep and howl for your miseries that shall come upon you. -- James 5:1

    Be more righteous than the scribes and Pharisees.
    Except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven. -- Matthew 5:20

    Eat Jesus' body and blood.
    Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you. Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day. -- John 6:53-54

    Just ask.
    Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.-- Matthew 7:7-8

    All you need is love.
    Love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God. -- 1 John 4:7
    He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou? And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself. And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live. -- Luke 10:26
  • Dorian Ertymexx

    Free Spirit skrev 2007-09-18 23:09:21 följande:


    Har du tenkt på det som står i NT om ekteskap? Det står kun beskrevet hvordan mann og kvinne skal leve sammen. Om homosexuallitet var fra Gud ja, da hadde han komt med råd til dem med.
    Det står att man helst inte ska gifta sig alls, och att man får gifta sig med flera. Bara biskopar får rådet att vara monogama.
  • Dorian Ertymexx
    gudrun skrev 2007-09-18 23:15:06 följande:
    Ja!Det står ju att en man och hans hustru skall vara ett! Free Spirit skrev 2007-09-18 23:09:21 följande:
    Nope. Eller jo, det står det, men bara i vissa stycken. I andra stycken är kvinnan mannens ägodel, ges råd om polygami, och förklaras att om mannen bara så är en smula svartsjuk så kan han låta stena sin fru. Eller ligga med den hushållsnära tjänsten, om frun är ogin. Jag förstår varför kristdemokraterna var så glada på att sponsra hemhjälp...
  • Dorian Ertymexx
    gudrun skrev 2007-09-19 00:08:13 följande:
    På vilket sett står jag inte för mina åsikter menar du då? Onaturligt betyder ju...onaturligt! Sen så "väljer" inte jag att ta till bibeln,för att jag inte "står för mina åsikter"...Det är så,att jag tror bibeln är sanningen.
    Du, det är LÅNGT mer onaturligt att sitta vid en dator och chatta om en skrift än att ha sex med samkönade. Homosexualitet är otroligt vanligt i naturen, för vissa arter till och med vardagligt. Finns homosexualitet bland naturfolk. Men inte datorer. Eller biblar, för den delen.

    Så vad som är onaturligt gör du nog bäst i att inte ta upp som argument.
Svar på tråden tycker du att homosexuella ska få gifta sig i kyrkan?